Ca18Det vs. Sr20Det

[sofo259]

i decided im gonna swap in either a ca or an sr but i cannot decide..

the Sr's have more aftermarket support, newer, and more common..
the Ca's have less aftermarket support, older(i'd have to granny it) and not as common..

at first i wanted a ca because of the iron block, and i heard Sr's have overheating problems.. and basically every boosted 240 on the road has a sr20..

both swaps are pretty easy..

but the ca18 seems like it would be pretty hard to get a good 350 hp out of..

help me decide

[Casey]

rb26det
=D
do it do it do it
lol
or 2jz-gte =D

nah those are bigger motors but honestly i think you outta drop an sr20 in it. you can pull 400 + hp out of it easilly
not to sure about the ca18 but i iknow the sr20 is proven... its not just an ultra common motor its also a great ultra common motor

[Wedge]

Things are popular for a reason. I would go SR any day.

Only reason I would consider a CA is if I wanted to be different, and could get one cheap. I hear over 300whp mean internals, and iron blocks do weigh more.

[zcrew]

From your post, you didn't really say anything positive about the CA, so I think you've already got your answer. So you may not be standing apart from the crowd in your engine picking, there's still plenty of other things to be individualistic about.

[babowc]

go to zilvia.net..
sr is 1850 shipped from one of their sponsors.
not a shabby deal imo.

maybe ill end up with a sr after i finish my ka-t.

i think sr overheats b/c ppl run them on stock rads?

[Wedge]

Koyo = cheap insurance.

I have forgotten to turn my fans on in traffic, and no problems. I think most of the problem people have are from hot lapping on stock radiators.

[v-empire]

use fan shroud, never ever ever ever ever overheat.

as far as ca, sr, rb, 2j,1j, 3sgte, 4ag, vq,vk, ls1,ka,b16, b13, b18c, k20, 4g63,420a, ej20,302, 301, boeing, ....no comment.


good luck

[sofo259]

yea, well it looks like the Sr is my answer..
$1850 is awesome.. im def. gonna check that out..

[sofo259]

im getting a s15 sr20 with vvt for $2200 :) :)

btw wtf is vvt ??

[Casey]

use fan shroud, never ever ever ever ever overheat.

as far as ca, sr, rb, 2j,1j, 3sgte, 4ag, vq,vk, ls1,ka,b16, b13, b18c, k20, 4g63,420a, ej20,302, 301, boeing, ....no comment.


good luck


dude....
hahaha we need faq on all those engines cuz um i know most... but not all?
lmao
i should do a weird engine swap thats like never been seen before... maybe srt10 vipah motah ! wut wut
lmfao
think it would clear?
i think it would clear =D

[Casey]

im getting a s15 sr20 with vvt for $2200 :) :)

btw wtf is vvt ??

variable valve timing
s15 chassis sr20 had it
its a blackslant top
220 hp stock?

[sofo259]

SWEET !!!

[plv]

variable valve timing
s15 chassis sr20 had it
its a blackslant top
220 hp stock?


i thought it was 250hp stock, ball bearing t28

[NISMODUDE1988]

dude go with an RB20 there cheaper than an Sr20 and not many people have them, be different and unique most people have sr20s get an Rb i did iam soo satafiyed its got that one of a kind ROARRR!!!!

[Dgardi]

Go SR.

If you want to be original, be emo and get an SR anyway.


Plus, you can get around overheating. Look into oil cooling. Or just google SR heating problems.

[AFSil80]

I hear over 300whp mean internals, and iron blocks do weigh more.

No offense, but you have no idea what you are talking about when it comes to the CA18. Kick your HP guesstimate up another 100+, and just because it's cast iron doesn't mean it automatically weighs more. A CA18DET weighs damn near 50 lbs LESS than an SR20DET.

Plus, it doens't take much for a CA18 to outperform an SR20. By taking the $$ you save, you can get better results. And saying that it doesn't have the same aftermarket support is only half true. They don't have the same support in the US. Everywhere else, the CA18 has a LOT of support.

Fact:

On the same boost level and pump gas, a CA18 w/ T28, FMIC and 444 injectors will leave an SR20 VVT w/ FMIC in the dust. The only advantages the CA18 has is weight and the injectors. Don't forget the SR has 370's stock, so it's not much more of an advantage.

And for those that doubt and want to speculate...wait 3 weeks, and I'll post the video proof. :)

Either way, when it comes to the SR vs CA debate, it all depends on what you want out of your car, and fact is, BOTH are good performers on the street and track.

[plv]

i like mine except that its been kind of abused over the years so its not running in top form. i wish i could afford rebuilding it.

ca18det > redtop s13 sr20. im not sure about a s15 sr20 though.

here are some quotes from wikipedia:


Due to superior head design (cam on bucket, as opposed to the flawed complex and heavy rocker arm actuation of later motors like the SR and QR series), many enthusists consider the CA18DET to be the best engine platform since the FJ20ET that powered the legendary DR30 Skyline DOHC-RS.


The CA18 was deemed too expensive to produce, so it was replaced by the SR20.

edit: also once u know the right websites u can easily find just about any aftermarket part for it online

[NISMODUDE1988]

ok if you do decide to go SR20 get an S13 sr20 they have way more bolt ons. by the way DONT get an S15 Sr20 its pointless

[Casey]

ok if you do decide to go SR20 get an S13 sr20 they have way more bolt ons. by the way DONT get an S15 Sr20 its pointless

why?
lol more donkeys
newer
thats better

[AFSil80]

WTF yo talkn bit.

SR20s bein nwers. UK CA18s are n wewe htan redhead sr20s. my Uk CA18 is a 93, adn it has the bst head desigfnoff all CA18s. 4runner 4 opprt biatch. just csz it s a ca dont mean its old. j spec ca's are older ya, but not all ca's are pos motors. for insatnce. my half cut only has 88k on it. tahts 54k miles, which is les shtan most ofthe SR20 half cuts left in japan. 2 years ago, sr blak heds ewre 2k for a half cut, nowadas,your lucky 2o fet one foer 3000. i got myt ca for half dat,and for that other 1500, i got a GT28 r and JUN 272 cams, 600cc tomei injetcors, z32 maf and ecu to run it all.

wana argue about money wellspent/

ask mein setpmenber when i bring it home from podunk North dakota.

ca18 FTW biatch

[Wedge]

No offense, but you have no idea what you are talking about when it comes to the CA18. Kick your HP guesstimate up another 100+, and just because it's cast iron doesn't mean it automatically weighs more. A CA18DET weighs damn near 50 lbs LESS than an SR20DET.

First off, that is why I said I heard. Means that I have never had a CA, but from what I read on the internet (and yes every thing I hear on the internet is true) they don't like more than 300whp on the stock bottom end. I also never said that a CA weighs more than an SR. I said a aluminum block will be lighter than a cast iron block, which is true if the blocks were the same size (I am guessing the two are close.)


Plus, it doens't take much for a CA18 to outperform an SR20. By taking the $$ you save, you can get better results. And saying that it doesn't have the same aftermarket support is only half true. They don't have the same support in the US. Everywhere else, the CA18 has a LOT of support.

I am sure you can find plenty of parts on the internet for a CA18. Not as much as for an SR, but enough to achieve your power goals.


Fact:

On the same boost level and pump gas, a CA18 w/ T28, FMIC and 444 injectors will leave an SR20 VVT w/ FMIC in the dust. The only advantages the CA18 has is weight and the injectors. Don't forget the SR has 370's stock, so it's not much more of an advantage.

I doubt it. Just because it has bigger injectors don't mean crap. A T28 will max out about the same time the SR 370cc injectors. I think the small amount of displacement on an SR comes in more of advantage than the CA18's little bit bigger injectors.


And for those that doubt and want to speculate...wait 3 weeks, and I'll post the video proof. :)

I am waiting. If you want, we can pair your stock turbo CA against my stock turbo SR?


Either way, when it comes to the SR vs CA debate, it all depends on what you want out of your car, and fact is, BOTH are good performers on the street and track.

I agree.

On a side note: I only know 3 people that have owned a CA. 2 now own an SR and one has a KAT. They either blew it up, or couldn't get the power they wanted (there words, not mine, and yes I know you can blow any motor up.) But then again, I know a handful of people that go back and forth between SR and KA. You just have to find a motor you want, and stick with it.

[AFSil80]

btw, im drunk as fukl, but i stand by wha i said.

[Wedge]

btw, im drunk as fukl, but i stand by wha i said.

LOL.. it's all good. I am not trying to be an ass or anything. I tried to read your other post and it made my brain hurt.

English FTW

[Casey]

btw, im drunk as fukl, but i stand by wha i said.

HAHA i so totally knew you were drunk when i read the first post
lol nice typing m8
=D
haha thats so funny sorry

[AFSil80]

First off, that is why I said I heard. Means that I have never had a CA, but from what I read on the internet (and yes every thing I hear on the internet is true) they don't like more than 300whp on the stock bottom end. I also never said that a CA weighs more than an SR. I said a aluminum block will be lighter than a cast iron block, which is true if the blocks were the same size (I am guessing the two are close.)

well, no offense, CAs are QUITE smaller than SRs. Due to ehtier small size, theyre also mounted a bit farther back than the SR, which was another reason why I chose it over the SR20, since i'm pushin the car twarsds a road racing directons.




I am sure you can find plenty of parts on the internet for a CA18. Not as much as for an SR, but enough to achieve your power goals.

Well, thing is, depends on where u are. SRs in teh states have more supprt. CAs are widely suiported in Europs since all S13s had Ca18s unde the hood.

check out:

www.takakaira.com <--everything from clutches to valvesprings and downpipes
www.norrisdesigns.com < --shop that did the gasket-matched port job on my motor
www.horsham-developments.co.uk <--ECUs, fuel work for CA18s, also has CA18/S13 factory service manuals in English in PDF format




I doubt it. Just because it has bigger injectors don't mean crap. A T28 will max out about the same time the SR 370cc injectors. I think the small amount of displacement on an SR comes in more of advantage than the CA18's little bit bigger injectors.

I personally taped a race between 2 UK spec S14s (which are T28 w/ Nissan VVT) and a UK spec S13 w/ the aforementioned mods), and believe me when I said that the S13 walked the two S14s. And you can't blame it on the drivers when:

a) The only RHD car the S13 driver had ever owned was that same S13
b) One S14 driver had been born and raised in Japan, and had never driven an LHD car
c) The other S14 driver was stationed in Japan for 3 years and had an R32 GT-St the whole time, so he was NOT new to RHD at all.


[/quote]I am waiting. If you want, we can pair your stock turbo CA against my stock turbo SR?[/quote]

Well, no promises, but I don't plan on keepin my Ca18 stock. I don't have anything to prove. I'm not buildin this car to make my e-penis bigger, or make more friends. This car is my way of expressin myself, so I'm going t do it at my pace, wheterh it yields results or not. Bt hey, Im down for a freidnly race, it's all in fun.




.

On a side note: I only know 3 people that have owned a CA. 2 now own an SR and one has a KAT. They either blew it up, or couldn't get the power they wanted (there words, not mine, and yes I know you can blow any motor up.) But then again, I know a handful of people that go back and forth between SR and KA. You just have to find a motor you want, and stick with it.

But yea, like Isaid,it's all based on what people want. I love the CA18, hell,both my cars have one,. Some peoiple want SR20, that's cool, better than B18C5, IMO,so in the endi, it's all good.

Sorry if i made you have a headache, hahaha.

again, all in good fun. ask anyone that knows me, i sorta turn into a mr. jekyl and hyde when i get drunk. regardless, i just wanna have fun!

[AFSil80]

man, cuplke shots of tqulia and some jak and beer an the keyoboad is your ewors eney.

oh well, you guys kika ass! thisll bne funn to talk about tomror.w

thank go dfI an't gotta work!

[Joshua]

It's not possible to be original with a 240SX.

-Kid

[Casey]

It's not possible to be original with a 240SX.

-Kid

yes it is... lol
thats just a stupid statement to make...
you can to a million things that is highly orriginal
modify things
dont bolton
=D

[Cash]

i like mine except that its been kind of abused over the years so its not running in top form. i wish i could afford rebuilding it.

ca18det > redtop s13 sr20. im not sure about a s15 sr20 though.

here are some quotes from wikipedia:





edit: also once u know the right websites u can easily find just about any aftermarket part for it online


Haha, I found a quote from wikipedia also:

"WIKIPEDIA MAKES NO GUARANTEE OF VALIDITY

Wikipedia is an online open-content collaborative encyclopedia, that is, a voluntary association of individuals and groups working to develop a common resource of human knowledge. The structure of the project allows anyone with an Internet connection to alter its content. Please be advised that nothing found here has necessarily been reviewed by people with the expertise required to provide you with complete, accurate or reliable information."

:taunt:

[Cash]

ok if you do decide to go SR20 get an S13 sr20 they have way more bolt ons. by the way DONT get an S15 Sr20 its pointless

I agree. The S15 SR20 is 250hp stock. It's not very hard or very expensive to reach 250hp on an s13 sr.

[Casey]

Haha, I found a quote from wikipedia also:

"WIKIPEDIA MAKES NO GUARANTEE OF VALIDITY

Wikipedia is an online open-content collaborative encyclopedia, that is, a voluntary association of individuals and groups working to develop a common resource of human knowledge. The structure of the project allows anyone with an Internet connection to alter its content. Please be advised that nothing found here has necessarily been reviewed by people with the expertise required to provide you with complete, accurate or reliable information."

:taunt:

stuff like car information is all relative.
i have a wikipedia account and i actually delete the stuff that is like... oppinonated on wikipedia
stupid stuff like "less aftermarket parts for so and so" easier swap...
no one wants to knwo its an easier swap they wanna know cold hard facts duh
i = self appointed wiki-MOD lmao

[v-empire]

thats why i said i wont comment on this......i know which one i would choose and we have been doing all these swaps and racing the cars on roads, rally and drift tracks for years. i ll let you guys figure it out and debate over it......and honestly, debates of these have been in the forums for years and most of it is pointless..... i knew where it was going. at the end of the day, its your car, ....good luck. and cant wait to see it running with a new heart.

and yes, you can fit an srt10 motor in it.

tora attack factory
www.dentsport.com

[Cash]

srt10??? YEEEEEHHAAAAAAWWWWWWWW!!!

[sofo259]

wow, i was at school all day and this is what i come back to...
all in all now im going with a Ca or back to building my Ka.. since my friends talked me into it.. i know just about every boosted 240 on the road has an sr20 and for lots of reasons..
not as many ppl have a KaT or a Ca ... do some math and i can take the money that would go into a JDM engine and put that into a Ka and you can have a damn good engine..
all i want is about 300-350hp so i am sure i can get it from either motor i choose...

[FlatWoodsMonster]

use fan shroud, never ever ever ever ever overheat.

as far as ca, sr, rb, 2j,1j, 3sgte, 4ag, vq,vk, ls1,ka,b16, b13, b18c, k20, 4g63,420a, ej20,302, 301, boeing, ....no comment.


good luck


LOL

[santacruz77]

CA there are fucking bad ass!!!!! guy i know has ran like 22 pounds of boost for like 2 or 3 years very nice drive it daily, fast ran like a 11.9 i think or do a ls1, I have a all new kind of respect for CA motors if done right

[sofo259]

tonight one of my friends told me the worst thing about a sr20 is the oil pump..

true or not ??

[AFSil80]

tonight one of my friends told me the worst thing about a sr20 is the oil pump..

true or not ??

Personally, I think the rocker arm stoppers are the worst part of the SR20. :taunt:

[v-empire]

rocker arms are probably weakest part, but its still strong as hell when you compare stock vs stock. you can get RAS for cheap and they prevent the issue or just go solid lifters, which is a PITA but worth the money and time. not recomended for low budget, clueless, tuners tho....

oil pump? total nonsense....i know a local shop around atl who claims they had problems with them but infact they cant prove it was caused by it. in fact they even installed shims backwards and the rocker arms broke and they say the head is weak. ????? no credit.

there are a lot more success reliable stories than failures. my opinion...

good luck.

[Wedge]

tonight one of my friends told me the worst thing about a sr20 is the oil pump..

true or not ??

Oil pumps are fine. I can't think off hand that I have heard of a oil pump failing.

Redtops have oil pickup tube that doesn't have a bracket on it. At high rebs and high vibration they can break. All Blacktops have have a bracket. Swapping out the pickup is a piece of cake and only cost 40 bucks.

[Wedge]

Personally, I think the rocker arm stoppers are the worst part of the SR20. :taunt:


SRs don't come with RAS. Many people put them on after installing cams because the rocker arm tends to slide off the valve spring. With stock cams, they are pointless. I bounced mine off the rev limiter many times. They are cheap and very easy to install.

[sofo259]

ok good..
looks like im getting an sr.. even though everyone has one..
i've rode in 2 cars with an sr one was stock one had cams.. both of them blew my mind !!

[Alan]

but have you rode in a ca powered 240?

[Casey]

lmfao this thread is OLD

[andrew]

idk but griffin on here has a ca18 ask him about a $?(just a thought)

[sofo259]

i rode in a ca powered car the other night.. it was sweet.. and its got me hooked.. thats the next thing im getting after my 2way

[PLAY]

SR20 > CA18 and let that be all

[sofo259]

i like the fact i can almost rebuild a ca with one stop at autozone..
everyone has their own opinion about the 2 motors.. but i can get as much power as i need from a ca and still have a reliable car..

[Zippy69]

Yugo bishes!!!

[Burklow]

My buddy Jake had a SR20 swap in his S13. It wasn't the quickest thing on earth, but pulled great for just simple bolt ons (exhaust, FMIC). I think the power per dollar is better with an SR and you'd probably have less issues getting to 300-350 whp on stock internals safely.

[FlatWoodsMonster]

THIS SHIT IS OLD AS FUCK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[homeslicej2]

^yes, it is.

[dcz]

I am deciding which to get. I am aiming for 450whp. I can get my hands on a ca18 from a buddy and can buy a shell for $200. I would like to go with the ca just cause I have access to it without having to order.

The motor is completely disassembled and I can build it, sleeve it or do whatever when I put it back together.... Do you guys think 450whp is a realistic option for a ca? I know I will need to givens like larger turbo, injectors, blah blah blah... how is the availability on parts like those to come across for in the ca?

[JDori]

lol


450whp u would be better off boosting a KA.....

[chituntang]

You will be better off thinking about 6, or 8 cylinders

[MOOREOFSTEPHEN]

It's not possible to be original with a 240SX.

-Kid

In a way hes kinda right.... to me hes wrong. I'd say 90% of the time thats true... just a bunch of idiots have the same car and copy everyone. If you have a brain you can come up with new ideas all the time. Like I said 90% are idiots and don't have a brain which leads me to agree with KidSaru. So hes wrong/right ;)

oh by the way go CA...

I have an sr20... love it even though I've had lots of problems but don't be the same like everyone else. If I could go back I might change my pick... sr20 at the time sounded nice to me so I just went with it... to tell you the truth I wasn't all over anything... it was kinda like a close my eyes and go pick deal. Try something not so damn common. You will be fine and can survive with out having a damn sr20.

holy shit didn't notice this thread was from 5 years ago lmao

[JDori]

You will be better off thinking about 6, or 8 cylinders

not really it would be way cheaper to build a 450whp SR or KA than a 450whp RB......

now a V8....most of that money would be spent on a motor..but yea ls2 with some bolt ons and bam

[AFSil80]

Building a 450 whp CA will not be an easy task. I've been researching my build (480whp goal) for about a year now, and it will take agressive cams, AT LEAST a GT3076R, built bottom end, standalone, and every CA18 I've seen that makes decent power (450+) has upped the displacement whether it be a stroker kit or oversized pistons.

I'm a die hard CA18 guy, but parts are NOT EASY to come by.

Example: The engine harness I got from a private sale on NICO is in rough shape. I emailed Wiring Specialties to see if they'll repair it and they refused it since it's such an old and uncommon harness.

This is typically the response you're going to come across when trying to find stuff for this motor unless you feel like buying everything from England or Australia. They're awesome motors, under-rated and overlooked, but fact is, the market sucks for them.

EDIT: CP makes oversized pistons for it. I've read that the rods and crank can take over 400hp, but that still leaves the head unattended. I want mine to be reliable so I'm building it from the start.

[chituntang]

This is what I think:

When you want a 450whp 4 banger, you will most likely needed to build the internals, where as if you do a 1J, 1J, and RB25/26, you can put a bigger turbo and cams to do so. I had a friend that has a blacktop SR, 310whp with pretty much everything built. Yes the GT2871R set him back a little bit, but with his setup's cost, I would say a RB25 with a bigger turbo is a better bet. If he bring his car to TurboDave, a 1J with turbo upgrade would do the majic.

[v-empire]

sr20det w/
310 whp with gt2871?

something is wrong.

i made 316 whp 305 tq on a pump gas t28.

our 2871's push over 400 and about 360sh on street tune pump gas, stock motor.

tell your friend to reconsider mods and tuning. check other forums for dyno graphs and you should find some good tips and comparisons.. he should make more. good luck.

[JDori]

i think to big problem is no one reallt needs 450whp in 240..... 350 is plenty and 400whp is perfect.

[dcz]

I say 450. I would love anywhere in the range of 350-400whp. I am curious about the ca because I can get it for almost nothing. Im sure the guy would probably give it to me. Its taken apart and I guess I can build the motor as I reassemble it.

I am not familiar with nissan at all. I know about lexus/toyota motors and ls-x models, so this is new to me.

How much power can a stock ca hold safely? Whether its the head or the bottom end, I would like to get a good estimate to what I can run safely such as power, psi...etc...

[FlatWoodsMonster]

lol


450whp u would be better off boosting a KA.....


You will be better off thinking about 6, or 8 cylinders
Y'all would be better off ending this old ass thread. I mean you can get 450hp out off both but they still suck. CA18 is as old as the Star Wars films and SR20 is like an STD out brake.

[homeslicej2]

CA18 is as old as the Star Wars films and SR20 is like an STD out brake.:p

[AFSil80]

How much power can a stock ca hold safely? Whether its the head or the bottom end, I would like to get a good estimate to what I can run safely such as power, psi...etc...

If it runs strong, you should be able to see 300 on stock internals easily. You'll definetly need bigger injectors.

I mentioned earlier in this thread when I was drunk that night in England, but a close friend of mine laid down 330whp with a GT28RS @ 1 BAR, stock bottom end, 444cc injectors, and HKS 256 cams.

[Casey]

i think to big problem is no one reallt needs 450whp in 240..... 350 is plenty and 400whp is perfect.

what is 400hp... i cannot count that high.


I say 450. I would love anywhere in the range of 350-400whp. I am curious about the ca because I can get it for almost nothing. Im sure the guy would probably give it to me. Its taken apart and I guess I can build the motor as I reassemble it.

I am not familiar with nissan at all. I know about lexus/toyota motors and ls-x models, so this is new to me.

How much power can a stock ca hold safely? Whether its the head or the bottom end, I would like to get a good estimate to what I can run safely such as power, psi...etc...


Y'all would be better off ending this old ass thread. I mean you can get 450hp out off both but they still suck. CA18 is as old as the Star Wars films and SR20 is like an STD out brake.


lmfao

[JDori]

why can't you not counted this high?

[Casey]

why can't you not counted this high?

cuz i got 2 fingers and 1 toe amputated when i was a child.
it threw off my counting.

not to mension the phrases which involve counting on fingers and toes.

all my fingers = 8
all your fingers = 10

"fingers" = 8
"fingers" = 10

thus 8 = 10

therefore 400rwhp = 320rwhp by law of proportions.

thus 400rwhp = 320rwhp.

which means i cannot count to 400
unless you supply 500rwhp :P

[homeslicej2]

^:lmfao:Good one Casey.

[Casey]

:P

[JDori]

that was fucking awesome..... i wish i could quotes its fullness into my sig

[Cameron.]

I HATE SR'S!!!!!!!1 AND CA'S!!!!!!:evil::evil::evil::twisted: GO DIAF!!!!

[doctorsars]

If you want to be different, go with a 7MGTE or something.

[BlackMage]

If you want to be different, go with a 7MGTE or something.

phht 1JZ or 3S-GTE or hell 4AGE 20V :p

[FlatWoodsMonster]

phht 1JZ or 3S-GTE or hell 4AGE 20V :p

1j has been done 3S-GTE has been done. Where you been man????? But the 4AG is somthin new but no one will do that because that motor will do absolutely shit in a 240. It would be like giving a crippled man skies and saying "Now dont have too much fun!!!" thats pretty fucked man you should get a psychiatrist. http://www.macslift.com/wheelchair/Clearway.jpg

http://www.backpackertours.co.uk/britain_uk_england_tours/graphics/Ski-to-the-Max-03.jpg

[BlackMage]

I didn't say it hasn't been done, just different, at least for now.

[FlatWoodsMonster]

I didn't say it hasn't been done, just different, at least for now.

Swap in a RTA96 that would be cool.

[Casey]

Swap in a RTA96 that would be cool.

that would be sick.
2 stroke 18 square building floors of displacement! lawl